PvP Charger

[toby]

Just wanted to know opinions..
and NOT as in "I don't like using chargers,"
as in, do you think there's a better way to arrange it...
I'm about to make one and I'm searching for the fallowing items..
-Ebotd Battle Pike (eth)
-Ptorch
-Angelics (rings/ammy)
-fort
-rends
-goes
-anni
-razortale
-Umed Shako
-lidless
-cta
-res smcs
-and sharpys...or any other dmg charms.

and it's skills...
-20 might (Synergy)
-20 vigor (synergy)
-20 charge (no duh.)
-20 fanta
-1 into res aruas
-1 salvation
-and 1 into all the prerquisties...

and that, I think, aught to cut it...

idk if I aughta get lifers or sharpies though...
also, if anyone has any of that stuff I'm lookin' for I'll trade for it.

[dainbramage]

I don't like using chargers

---------------

For 2h charge, eth death decapitator is where it's at. Far outdamages any botd.


That said, 1h grief/hoz charge is far superior to 2h, not the least thanks to smite as a follow-up if your charge chain fails (in other words, you're not horribly farked as you would be with 2h).

Shako offers nothing that CoA does not, and if you're going to the str to wear rends (bad idea) then there is no reason not to use a CoA.

That said, I wouldn't use rends (but still use CoA). I'd put down dracs for OW and strength. People who whine about lifetap obviously have no clue about walk-away and should be ignored (plus as you'll generally kill in a few hits, it won't be too much of an issue).

Razortail = WTFBBQ. Seriously. Dungos or string is where it's at for belts, there is no substitute for DR.

Switch lidless for a spirit on switch, easy extra point on your BO.

You're missing CBF on your gear. I'd switch out your jewellery for raven/raven/highlords (massive damage boost), and only use angelics when necessary.

----------
Skills:


Charge, fanat, vigour is correct.

From here, might is mostly overkill - I personally would much prefer to instead invest in smite/HS to buff up your defence and not end up too top-heavy, hit-or-miss, etc. In other words to make sure you're not 100% screwed if your charge misses/is blocked.

The useful 1pt wonders are holy freeze and salvation (don't bother with res fire/cold/light, waste of 3 skill points).

So, skills should look like (according to me):

20 charge
20 fanat
20 vigour
20 HS
1 HF
1 salvation
Rest in smite

[toby]

Razortail: for the max dmg and dex(more AR)
I don't need dr is I don't plan on getting hit all that often.

as for HS, well..Omnicide has a charger that uses 2h BattlePike, and I haven't been able to beat it yet.

If it fail, you just charge AWAY. I do it all the time with my smiter...
I'm mostly after the 1hit kill stuff, and I can hit around 30k with a ebotd battlepike...
I can't see going past 12k with a 1h greif..
there are alot of builds that'll take 2-4 of those

As for the Rends...you are right, i didn't see the str req for those o.O
Draks it is. and i don't rly care what people think about the LT, everyone on bnet is bm to me, why shouldn't I be...

As for the Shako..well not all of us can afford a CoA...

[Zarley]

Since you're 2-handed I wouldn't bother with Shako/CoA. I'd wear Kira's and COH for max res. You don't want a trap or a stray T-Storm shot from a lite sorc to wtfpwn you.

Personally I'd go with dain's suggestion of eth Death decap.. the eBOTD warpike CANNOT compete without the damage output of the Death decap after the Deadly Strike is factored in. Otherwise I'd go with an eBOTD Archon Staff... still has excellent damage, but you can go base STR with it. And the range 5 of the WarPike will greatly hamper your ability to chain-charge, vs. the range 2 of the Archon Staff.

[Omnicide]

Seriously, listen to dain, toby. He knows what he's talking about with chargers and I got my info from him and MilkMan.

I don't use a BotD War Pike.....at all. I use a non eth Death Decapitator....because I couldn't find an eth. D:

You will get hit as a pure charger...especially if you miss...charging away doesn't work as well as you'd think...it gives them PLENTY of time for a followup hit(s) that can possibly KO you.

BotD War Pike has too much a range in damage...don't always base it on top damage because that's not too smart.
Grief/HoZ is for higher block percentage in case your charge misses...leaving you at point blank range for an attack. Charge chains with Grief>Hit or misses with OHKO builds.

I'm just gonna shut up about going to BM....because it's the same thinking everyone uses to validate BM.

[Immortal_Daemon]

I've never been too special with Chargers, though I'd like to be.
I'm a stickler for stacked res's, no matter what char, so I've never really gotten into Chargers.

However... has anybody ever tried an Eth Tomb Reaver on a Charger? That dishes out damage like crazy, and it has res on it to boot.

[Omnicide]

Maybe Eth Tomb Reaver for elemental characters, but Death Decapitator (or can be made in a Glorious Axe) are perfect for a charger. No IAS needed, and the high DS almost ensures double the damage...even more ensured when used with the Highlord's/Ravens combo dain mentioned.

And Chargers are still capable of stacking res pretty well. I usually put on an Um'd Kira's and put on Salvation, if I need it. Sure my damage lacks, but I think the survivability is worth it.

Plus I have 10x 3-5 res small charms in my inventory for help.

My thing is...do you need to have a certain FRW to desynch with charge or...is it pretty much charge=desynch if used in the right pattern?

[Immortal_Daemon]

You don't need FRW at all, as far as I know.

Generally you have a little bit from boots anyway, but I'm pretty sure you don't need any.

[dainbramage]

Item-based FRW doesn't work with charge, for one (skill-based [a la vigour, though if a pally could have bos/IS then they'd work also] DOES).

Charge alone will desync - if you want to desync bigtime, vigour charging can create serious problems for your opponent.


OT: I'm assuming your smiter has reasonable defence and max block, toby? This is why he can charge away again. A low defence block-less charger will get wtfpowned on the retal after the attack fails.

[Omnicide]

Ah ok, I was wondering why Enigma didn't help me all that much on the descyncing.

Yeah....chargers pretty much have to aim for OHKO or chain locks if they go two hand weapons. ._.;;

But I just refuse to have a smiter...>_>

[dainbramage]

You're mostly a charger - 3/4 of your skills are devoted to charge, as is your gear. Smite is just a backup for when a charge-chain stalls.

[Omnicide]

If you go the Grief/HoZ route, that is.

I've been sucking with 2H charging so I'll probably go with that combo relatively soon.

[Zarley]

OT: I'm assuming your smiter has reasonable defence and max block, toby? This is why he can charge away again. A low defence block-less charger will get wtfpowned on the retal after the attack fails.

Charge automatically flags your character as "running" so defense is 0 and block is 25% tops.

[Omnicide]

I think he means more along the lines of if your charge fails to hit and you're left at point blank the defense/block helps. ._.;;

*just guessing*

[kenji51590]

hey what about using a pheonix shield? adds around 300-385% ed i think w/ a grief that has 300-???% ed

oh also what is a good range of ar for a charger?

sry 350-400 ed on both of them

[Immortal_Daemon]

Grief does not have the edmg mod on it.
It's pure damage.

The difference can be huge, depending on the weapon (on a berserker axe, it's not, but on something like a Phase Blade it is).

[dainbramage]

I think he means more along the lines of if your charge fails to hit and you're left at point blank the defense/block helps. ._.;;

*just guessing*

Correct.

[toby]

K,thanks for the help.

What I've decided to do is keep my smiter. Well I have lvl 10charge, and I plan on getting to lvl 90, so ill max it, and switch to Angelics when I feel like charging stuff...
After all, i already get 12k charge, and 7k AR..and with angelics I got 16k AR
Good enough for me :D

[Omnicide]

hey what about using a pheonix shield? adds around 300-385% ed i think w/ a grief that has 300-???% ed

oh also what is a good range of ar for a charger?

sry 350-400 ed on both of themMaybe if you can make it in a paladin shield I'd recommend it, but in a monarch the block rating will be hell...even if you have Holy Shield. If you're willing to part with some dex points for max block then use it.

Hm...come to think of it, I've always seen Alma Negra as a sort of "charging shield". The AR and ED bonus and all.

Good AR depends on the characters you're facing. For sorcs and other low defense characters you should get by with 9-12k. For the higher defense like Smiters and BvBs you're going to want a lot of AR...easily 20k-30k+. I think I hit about 32k max.

[kenji51590]

idk how to get that high or ar.. i currently have 7k sadly.. I use an ebotdz (currently will get the griefz later) pheonix shield (pally shield) shako berd fort highlords bloodfists dungos 2x ravens gores

[Omnicide]

Well I only use high AR vs high defense opponents, no normally I have around 12k AR.

Normally you'd use Angelic ammy/2x rings for AR...and Hsarus' boots/belt for even more AR.

[kenji51590]

oh ok ty i will get those

[Omnicide]

It should be noted that with Death Decapitator (or even Grief/BotD with shield) you should use Highlord's and dual Ravens for the high chance of being able to get DS from Highlord's while still having some decent AR from the Ravens.

[citaro94]

it all depends on if you want to be 1-handed or 2-handed. eth death decapitator = best 2 hand. and eth death (some other 1-hand sword, dont really remember). all depends if you want to be glass cannon or defend>dmg

[Kakashi Hatake]

im making one of these atm and im curious

is Edeath bezerker > Grief?

i already have a grief im just curios if i should trade for a Edeath zerker (not Edc) b/c i was planning on having a 1 hand wep/shield and 2 hand wep in stash


ty

[Riddleboxx]

Two hand I like the Eth Death Decapitator.

But I prefer the block setup:

Helm: P Gaze socketed with Cham
Belt: P string
Ammy: Angelics
Rings: Angelics
Armor: AP Fort
Weapon: Grief Phase
Shield: Ber'd Alma Negra with as close to 75AR and ED as you can find
Boots: Gores
Gloves: Dracs


This is what my charger wears, you know..........what I'm realizing now is that you need a tremendous amount of AR. He has like 30k but that's still not good enough because I simply didn't put enough points into dex.


I believe a charger needs an inventory full of AR GC's or they need to be totally Glass..........because IMO it's one of the toughest builds I've ever made. Just now I'm getting him right. He's powerful though.


Also Note something:


You need FHR and REsistances with my build. So happy hunting.

Reccomend 15 res +6 dex GC's.

[taxfree]

Two hand I like the Eth Death Decapitator.

But I prefer the block setup:

Helm: P Gaze socketed with Cham
Belt: P string
Ammy: Angelics
Rings: Angelics
Armor: AP Fort
Weapon: Grief Phase
Shield: Ber'd Alma Negra with as close to 75AR and ED as you can find
Boots: Gores
Gloves: Dracs


This is what my charger wears, you know..........what I'm realizing now is that you need a tremendous amount of AR. He has like 30k but that's still not good enough because I simply didn't put enough points into dex.


I believe a charger needs an inventory full of AR GC's or they need to be totally Glass..........because IMO it's one of the toughest builds I've ever made. Just now I'm getting him right. He's powerful though.


Also Note something:


You need FHR and REsistances with my build. So happy hunting.

Reccomend 15 res +6 dex GC's.

dude, your setup sucks ****s.

EDeathZ>Grief PB.
Ber'd g-face>cham'd vgaze.
Phoenix ST>alma negra.

Also, use a god damn raven for CBF.

[September 28, 1987]

dude, your setup sucks ****s.

EDeathZ>Grief PB.
Ber'd g-face>cham'd vgaze.
Phoenix ST>alma negra.

Also, use a god damn raven for CBF.

Lol, those are all very valid points.

You could use a visionary helm also.

[Omnicide]

I usually had a CoA somewhere for DR.

[Riddleboxx]

dude, your setup sucks ****s.

EDeathZ>Grief PB.
Ber'd g-face>cham'd vgaze.
Phoenix ST>alma negra.

Also, use a god damn raven for CBF.

lmfao........you realize that piece of crap Death has Zero IAS?

So that means you're absolutely pure charge. You don't switch zeal or smite eh?

Also Guillames? For what? CB? Where's the DR?

Phoenix? LMFAO you can't redeem player's corpses and also I hate to break the news......whoever attempts max block with a monarch is a moron.

Your ideas suck as well.


Game name? I'll pk synch your charger, right now.

[Omnicide]

lmfao........you realize that piece of crap Death has Zero IAS?

So that means you're absolutely pure charge. You don't switch zeal or smite eh?Some chargers go that way. In that instance...IAS doesn't matter.

Also Guillames? For what? CB? Where's the DR?Guill's has 15 DS. Edit: Read as DS. In his defense still...Gaze has crap *** mods besides the DR.

Phoenix? LMFAO you can't redeem player's corpses and also I hate to break the news......whoever attempts max block with a monarch is a moron.Pallies have the advantage with shields. They can make phoenix in PALLY shields. Go fig. Plus...Phoenix has 400 ED.

Your ideas suck as well.The only thing you have him on is that his choices are bad for a charger planning to link with zeal or smite.


Game name? I'll pk synch your charger, right now.And ended in classic retarded JSP fashion....nice.

[dainbramage]

dude, your setup sucks ****s.
Yes
EDeathZ>Grief PB.
As much as I love death... no. Damage is pretty much the same on charge (with guillaume's, grief should do slightly more), but grief gives you a decent follow-up smite for the 3/4 times that you're blocked. That said, a zerker grief is more useful for its extra range on smite than a pb.
Ber'd g-face>cham'd vgaze.
Yes
Phoenix ST>alma negra.
Yes, but I wouldn't use either of the two. 400ed really isn't that much when you already have 2k +. Hell, a lance guard adds about as much damage (on average) as a phoenix. Add in its FHR, and phoenix's proc, and I reckon it'd be a better shield than phoenix, with 4 less d00pz.

Either way, I'd probably end up going with either a hoz or ss.
Also, use a god damn raven for CBF.
If you're going the one-trick pony charge, you'd want to cram as much AR on as possible, at least if you're whacking anything with respectable defence. With a decent smite, sure, go for 1 raven.



EDIT: Also, lol dracs. Use bloodfists.

SoE is a GREAT belt... for pvm. For pvp purposes, it is utterly outclassed by verdungo's. Same DR, useless leech and negligible mdr is replaced with life and fhr.

EDIT 2: I really should read entire posts.

lol @ pumping dex for AR. There are far better sources than that. Also, chargers have got to be one of the easiest builds to play, if not the very easiest. Pure chargers also aren't particularly good...

[September 28, 1987]

I usually had a CoA somewhere for DR.

LOL! I don't know how I left that one out.

Yes, Coa is one of the main helms a Charger would/should use.


So that means you're absolutely pure charge. You don't switch zeal or smite eh?

You will still have smite. Zeal is choice but it's not a bad idea.

Phoenix? LMFAO you can't redeem player's corpses and also I hate to break the news......whoever attempts max block with a monarch is a moron.

He said ST which has the highest chance to block for Paladin-only shields. It has nothing to do with corpses but Phoenix adds damage.

Game name? I'll pk synch your charger, right now.

If you want, my friend has probably the best Charger I've ever seen. It's pure charge but uses smite/zeal at times.

Anyways, I'm not trying to argue with you. :)


As much as I love death... no. Damage is pretty much the same on charge (with guillaume's, grief should do slightly more), but grief gives you a decent follow-up smite for the 3/4 times that you're blocked. That said, a zerker grief is more useful for its extra range on smite than a pb.

You make a good point. I guess two handed Death is best but you're probably right about Grief lol.

EDIT: Also, lol dracs. Use bloodfists.

You could also use crafted gloves (giving you IAS, CB, Dex/Life, whatever).

SoE is a GREAT belt... for pvm. For pvp purposes, it is utterly outclassed by verdungo's. Same DR, useless leech and negligible mdr is replaced with life and fhr.

Yes, Verdungos is the obvious choice.

[Omnicide]

For a weapon/shield I would go with Grief for the IAS.

Also Hoz for the balance, imo. I'm with Dain and aren't into Alma or Phoenix for the damage.

I'd probably still have a 2h Death though...4 da laffs...and because I love those OHKO times...I don't care if I die a million times...that one OHKO is worth all those deaths.

Guessing Gunit is talking about Rhino. o;

[DESTROYTHEAIRSHIP]

Thanks for the corrections dain.

For a weapon/shield I would go with Grief for the IAS.

Also Hoz for the balance, imo. I'm with Dain and aren't into Alma or Phoenix for the damage.

I'd probably still have a 2h Death though...4 da laffs...and because I love those OHKO times...I don't care if I die a million times...that one OHKO is worth all those deaths.

Guessing Gunit is talking about Rhino. o;

and yes, THOMAS IS TALKING ABOUT RHINOCEROS

[russpopsicle]

hey whatsup everyone, as of right now my charger is a charge/zeal din
im not particularly rich so my gear is not perfect and godly,
i have a raven spiral ring 09 permed, raven frost, ber'ed coa, coh, ebotdz 381 ed, um'ed hoz, some crap 1 to pal skill and 15 str ammy, gores, dungos, dracs, 6/5/2 cta and lidless for switch off, and an anni plus mass amounts of res some ar and psn charms, i do not want to have smite at all, i hate smite, should i change anything out though? should i add points to dex? my ar is 9k=****ty i do 5-13k dmge plus deadly strike i can 1 hit kill most if not all casters/zons 2-3 hit hdins and smite/zeal/chargers and suck with barbs any help?

[evanthebouncy]

FYI you don't need increase AR at all. Just switch on Conviction, -90% Def for them. gG.
Conviction is better than Fanat for chargers in most cases, unless you want to smite, then it's another story.

[Omnicide]

Iirc....Conviction doesn't lower total defense, does it?

[jrob624]

Conviction does lower Defense by a % up to 90% @ lvl 20.

Conviction
Required Level: 30
Prerequisites: Might [1], Thorns [6], Holy Fire [6], Holy Freeze [18], Sanctuary [24]


It is fearsome enough to behold the power of a Paladin, let alone a Paladin aglow with the aura of Conviction. This halo of righteousness demonstrates, with force, the grim determination of those who shine within its brilliance. Any who stand against the Paladin and his allies will understand the meaning of folly.

Effect: Reduces enemy Defense and the Resistances of monsters.


This aura does not lower an enemy's magic or poison resistance. Conviction will remove immunities which will allow you or your party members to damage monsters that were previously untouchable with immunities. There is a cap of -150% resistance and you will not be able to remove some monster's immunities in hell level.
This aura, when breaking an immunity, will only function at 1/5 effectiveness.
Level 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
Radius 13.3 Yards
Defense -% 49 56 61 66 70 73 75 77 79 80 82 83 85 86 86 88 88 89 89 90
Maximum Resist -% 30 35 40 45 50 55 60 65 70 75 80 85 90 95 100 105 110 115 120 125

[Omnicide]

Yes, but I'm wondering if it lowers base defense, total defense or if it's just a counter to %EDef.

As in if it's an anti-Edef or if it works like -target defense.

[jrob624]

-% (enhanced) defense ... so it applies to modified defense rating from shout and such. lets say it was a lvl 12 shout by Madawc (ancient) in hell would be 210% and a lvl 20 conviction against it would only give a reduction to 120%. Target defense gets applied after + Enhanced Defense.

[Omnicide]

Yeah I know. I've just heard weird rumors through the years that Convic worked on the total number for defense...and thought that was a bit messed up. ._.;

Eh...I can handle the equivalent of 9 less levels of Shout/Iron Skin.

If I had it in me, I'd run numbers to see which is the better choice for scoring a hit.

[dainbramage]

Yeah I know. I've just heard weird rumors through the years that Convic worked on the total number for defense...and thought that was a bit messed up. ._.;

Eh...I can handle the equivalent of 9 less levels of Shout/Iron Skin.

If I had it in me, I'd run numbers to see which is the better choice for scoring a hit.

Against a barb/pally, fanaticism.


EDIT: It's not hard to work out. You don't need to plug actual numbers, just get the ratio of % boosts.

[Vanysh_CCB]

Hello everyone, I am a new user, and I would be interested to prepare a charge paladin really hot XD
So far I managed to get my hands on an Coa 2 sok, verdungo, nosferatu, bloody knight, Raven, Dracula's Grape, Steelrend 56% damage, fury higlord, metal grids, sandstorm, fortytude, and a Breath of Dying on Hammer of Thunder ethereal 398% Damage (294/1344).
Given the professionalism of the forum, I needed advice and details on these items, especially as increasing degree of attack, because as I wander about 42k damage max.
Hello and thanks XD