Making an Hdin/Smiter...need input.

[Omnicide]

So...I'm finding my orber is having a tough time key running. No surprise, two of the bosses that drop keys are or are surrounded by cold immunes...so I want to get a character that has no problems with immunities in PvM...an hdin. Well on the other hand I'm going to try to make sure it can smite, too, to deal with ubers. Here's the gear/skill setup I have.

Skills attempting to max:

Blessed Hammer
Blessed Aim
Vigor
Fanaticism

One pointers needed for the build:

Smite
Holy Shield
Salvation
Meditation
All prerequisites

I know you're going to think I need Conc. I'm using a merc with pride to take care of that since I'll only be hammering for key runs...and once I'm in ubers the merc is useless, anyway.

Smiter Gear:

Guillaume's (open socket)
CoH
Dracs
TGod's
Gores
HoZ (open socket)
Grief PB
Mara's
Raven
Dwarf (or would Wisp be a better choice?)
Spirit/CTA on switch
Torch/Anni and whatever res and/or life charms I can find

Hdin setup:

Shako (open socket)
Enigma
Mages
Arach's
Gores (either not sure or not a big deal to me to have seperate boots)
HotO
HoZ
Mara's
2xSoJ
Spirit/CTA
Torch/Anni etc.

Merc:

Pride
Fort/Stone/Duress/whatever
Guillaume's/Gaze (not sure if I have another Guill's)

So yeah...in short, do you think this build would be good for the task it's assigned? Hdin for key running and smiter for the ubers. I had to put a lot into the hammer stuff to make it even decent. It's got 8k hammers, 3k life (I haven't accounted for life charms), not sure on smite damage but I figure Grief should be ok, 50% CB for the smiter and...yeah.

Not a guide or anything, just seeing what you guys think.

[September 28, 1987]

I think it's easiest building as close to a Hammerdin as possible with point in Smite/Fantacism (swap to Smite gear) and it should be fine.

Ely is the one to ask. Hammerdin basically but could smite Ubers with almost ease.

[Omnicide]

Yeah...I just used the extra points into Fana just in case...since I could use Pride for my Conc...save me a few points.

And yeah...there's definitely gear swapping. ._.;

[saracen85]

well, you can stick with concentration as your main aura. it does provide extra ed for your smite, fanaticism. not as much, but you don't have to spend more skill points.

ar from fana won't benefit your smite, and the ias can be made up elsewhere..

with a grief pb, you'll only need another 30-40 ias to reach 6frame smite without fanaticism. you can socket ias jewels in your gear.

or if you're using some other weapon and hurting for ias, stick ias jewels in a pally shield =)

[Omnicide]

Well I used Fana because it would add the most damage to Smite...off the top of my head. Since I'm using Conc from my merc...I can spare those points to have a better smiter when I have to use it against the ubers. I'm not real fond of the idea to use jewels to increase my IAS...especially since I'd be losing the ability to tele...or all of the great mods from HoZ.

[saracen85]

actually, it's all up to you.. =)

with fana: you'll have better smite, lower hammer damage and heavy dependability on your merc.

with conc: lower/ slower smite, higher hammer dmg and merc can die whenever it wants to =P

[Immortal_Daemon]

I hate having to switch gear, so if it were me.....


Wep: Wizzy + Shael (fastest IAS bp with Fana)
Shield: Upped HoZ / Res Exile
Armor: Enigma
Helm: Guillaume's + UM
Belt: Arach
Gloves: Magefists
Boots: Gores
Ammy: Metalgrid
Ring: Ravenfrost
Ring: Wisp
Switch: CTA + Spirit (Life Tap wand, depending on shield)


That will grant you enough res, fcr, and ias to survive.

Skills:

Hammer: 20
Vigor: 20
Blessed Aim: 20
Holy Shield: 20
Smite: 1
Fana: Rest


That outta do it for you.



It's what I'd do, anyway.

[Omnicide]

Well it's just for key running/ubers...it's not like I'm dueling or anything. ;P

But yeah...I could use the Wizzy now that I look at it.

So I'm guessing you're telling me to depend on the pride merc, too eh?

And Holy Shield yields more damage than Fana? O_o

[Zarley]

meh. i'd make a standard hammerdin, and just use a Beast in UberTrist. Plenty of speed, plenty of damage (Conc + Fanat), and while your on-weapon crushing blow is a tad low, it should be plenty.

Without Concentration your hammer damage is just crippled, and you don't want to depend on your merc for it.

Otherwise saracen's dead-on about the phase blade. 65 IAS with a phase blade and no fanaticism nets you max-frame Smite.

[Immortal_Daemon]

Well it's just for key running/ubers...it's not like I'm dueling or anything. ;P

But yeah...I could use the Wizzy now that I look at it.

So I'm guessing you're telling me to depend on the pride merc, too eh?

And Holy Shield yields more damage than Fana? O_o



Well, Holy Shield is more important (IMO) since it will also grant you defense, which is important regardless of which character you use.

Not to mention with your other gear, your Fana should definitely be boosted enough to give you the necessary IAS to reach the break point.


But yes, I find a Wizzy to be an amazing item. The res and fcr on it are just too damn good to pass up; it's extremely versatile.

And finally yes, you'll have to rely on the merc. While I don't normally like relying on mercs, for this particular character it's almost required.
If you don't want to rely on a merc, you'll have to sacrifice significant Smite damage.

[saracen85]

the damage difference isn't that significant, even when using grief..

conc: 1st point provides 60ed, subsequent points provide 15 ed. at lvl20 = 345ed

fana: 1st point provides 50ed, subsequent points provide 17ed. at lvl20 = 373ed

28ed difference is pretty small. assuming perfect grief damage, you'll only lose ~100+ smite damage. not much.

[September 28, 1987]

I don't think relying on the Merc is a good idea.

And you want Fanaticism for the speed, not the damage. It's much quicker than Concentration (obviously) but the Ubers shouldn't be terribly difficult with one point each. Just carry enough pots and take it slowly and you should be fine.

[Omnicide]

meh. i'd make a standard hammerdin, and just use a Beast in UberTrist. Plenty of speed, plenty of damage (Conc + Fanat), and while your on-weapon crushing blow is a tad low, it should be plenty.

Without Concentration your hammer damage is just crippled, and you don't want to depend on your merc for it.

Otherwise saracen's dead-on about the phase blade. 65 IAS with a phase blade and no fanaticism nets you max-frame Smite.I could manage 7 frame Smite, as is, with BeastZ. I really don't want to use two sockets for IAS jewels just for that purpose. I'd rather Um the Guillaume's and HoZ since I have less res scs than I thought. It's not really the damage that's worrying me as much as my smite speed...like Gunit mentioned. (September to you guys.)

@ID...Well you shouldn't need too much defense vs monsters, right? I would think the bigger threat in Uber Trist is the elements than physical damage. I'm just trying to figure out which of the three would be best for smite...Smite, Fana or Holy Shield.

@Gunit...Yeah I'm mostly trying to figure which to focus my remaining skill points in after BH, BA and Vigor or which weapon to use...Wizzy for res...BeastZ if I can get the rest of the IAS...or Grief if I can manage with a minimum Fana...since I'd only need level 2 Fana for the max IAS with Grief PB.

[safetypro]

Here's a unique idea that might work. If you use a Phase Blade, as Zarley pointed out you need 65% IAS for 6 frame Smite. Take the lowest Grief at 30% IAS...so 35% more IAS and you're there. Highlords for the amulet (20% IAS) and a Scintillating Jewel of Fervor (15 all resist/15% IAS) in your Helm. Kill 2 birds with one stone. Get the resists you need and the IAS to reach 6 frame Smite.

I agree with Saracen and Zarley, the damage increase to Smite from Fanaticism over Concentration is negligible and the speed and AR won't be needed if you can obtain the IAS elsewhere, so favor the hammer damage by maxing Concentration. You will have a much more versatile build by making a pure Hammerdin and gear swapping to Smite for Ubers.

[dainbramage]

Safetypro beat me to it...

Build as an hdin, swap in a grief pb and ias jooled guillaume's and some other ias (highlords works well), put on a 125 res stack (sanctuary shield does the trick nicely, if you consider an extra 65 res all more than HoZ to be handy) and you're good to go with a 1pt smite.


The damage difference will be negligible, and it will be high anyway using grief as a weapon. Guillaume's + gores is 50% CB, which is plenty. The rest of your gear can then be devoted to resistance.


What's better, slap on a grief/guill/gores (which I am currently very tempted to call "3G", someone slap me please) and you can run the 3 mini-ubers with ease, also. Hammer everything that isn't the boss, then smite to death.

[Omnicide]

Sounds, good. I guess I'll go with Safety's/your idea. I knew I needed at least Guill and Gores for decent CB...I guess I was mostly worried about reaching the top IAS bp. Wouldn't Sanctuary be overkill if I'm using CoH though? I dunno, I'm still not 100% sure how I'm sitting on resists. I'll change things according to how I'm sitting.

[dainbramage]

You need 300 res all (sans poison) for max res under convicton.

30 anya + 15 guill + 20 anni + 65 CoH + 69 HoZ = 199 res all, that's -26/-26/4/75 res all. Using sanctuary, it'll look like 20/20/50/75.

Unless you want to use a lot of res all charms, a sanctuary shield will make life much easier.

[Omnicide]

Yeah I know.

Worst case scenario I'd have to use Salvation or something to stay at max res, but then there goes my damage after CB is done doing its job. Then again...I'd only really need Salv until Meph is dead, right?

I'd have to use IAS jewels in the Guill and HoZ anyway if I want to hit the top breakpoint with Grief PB.

[kalenjder]

use a normal hdin build and put one point in fana and it's all gonna be fine for ubers.

[Omnicide]

Eh...a pure 1pt smite/fana smiter would have too low damage for my tastes.

I went with the IAS jewels and the smite is pretty damn fast...no matter which aura I choose. I figure I can use Salvation to counter Meph until I need the damage or so...or at least LT kicks in. Both sides seem to work relatively well. Let's hope it can take on ubers with minimal problems.

[September 28, 1987]

I really don't think you'll have a problem.

Treachery/Last Wish provides Fade for extra resists (not sure if that was covered or not) and lower damage just means it will take you longer to do. My smiter is using the poorest gear of all (I went cheap for kicks) and I'm more successful than not.

I'm just repeating but you should be fine.

[dainbramage]

The numbers I posted earlier were for a highlords ammy (hence the higher light res).


What makes meph dangerous isn't his damage output over time; it's the fact that he can instagib a character without max res very easily - if his frost skull crits, or you get hit by several charged bolts simultaneously you can take upwards of 2k damage after max res. If your res is 50 rather than 75, that means you're dead unless you have 4k + life.


Either way ought to work... just make sure your resistances are up to scratch.

[kalenjder]

what about making two characters?

[Omnicide]

The whole point was to make one dedicated character towards getting to/beating ubers. I don't really like having a whole ton of characters.

[Raven]

What you could do is not max vigor. use the left over points to half max conc, and HS. That would give you good smite damage and speed with maxed fanat. But still have viable hammer damage. Theres no way to make the build wokr without somethign into conc. Might go Off gcs in inverntory to raise the conc, then you could one point wonder it and max HS.

[kalenjder]

don't max vigor WTF?? vigor is more important than blessed aim, if it is anything you don't want to max it's blessed aim.

[Raven]

Yea i was thinking about it, swap that, cuase you woudl actualy use vigor later.

[Omnicide]

Welp just got done helping Aaron out with his ubers using this guy. Everything went fine.

I can use Salvation to counter Meph's Conviction and after that I can slap on conc for the win.

Thanks everyone, this guy works great.

[dainbramage]

What you could do is not max vigor. use the left over points to half max conc, and HS. That would give you good smite damage and speed with maxed fanat. But still have viable hammer damage. Theres no way to make the build wokr without somethign into conc. Might go Off gcs in inverntory to raise the conc, then you could one point wonder it and max HS.

The build already has maxed conc, vigour and blessed aim. HS does not need to be maxed for damage thanks to grief.


EDIT: Glad you're happy with it omni :).

[Murari]

umm.....why wont a pure h'din work??

magic immunes get pwned by hammers too....


so there's nothing immune to it :)

[Raven]

To my knowledge of reading dain, Concentration isnt even listed for points. Sry for trying to help....Must be a crime nowadays huh? Grief adds damage, but not that much. Building a smiter/hdin without having at least something into conc, and HS is a sure fire way of getting killed. But if omni is saying now that it works ill just stop there.

[rconnor]

I was wondering did 5% life tap on dracs cast enough to stay alive? or would you recommend using exile as well? (assuming using grief as weapon)